About: LONG TERM RELATIONSHIPS WITH THAI GUYS (title edited) : Resource Forum

Author: **Dodger** » Tue 30 Nov, 2004 6:52 am

As a Butterfly, I see a long term relationship (LTR) more in the sense of a long term friendship (LTF) to avoid the consequenses of long term dillusionment (LTD). 
 
During my last October visit, boy special got in one of his mood swings and said he wasn't in the mood for sex that day. I told him that I fully understood his feelings. As I slipped on my shoes and reached for the keys to the condo, he asked me where I was going. I told him I would be back in a few hours and that I was going out to have some sex. He immediately responded by telling me how wrong I was to do that and started lecturing me. I simply replyed..."you think too much." 
 
I've always had a tremendous respect for the working Thai boys, and always will, but at the same time, I don't drain my bank account to fly half-way around the planet 2 times a year to sit around an play with myself. 
 
The farangs that I know who claim to have LTR's are those who provide regular financial support to their BF's and are willing to accept the reality that LOVE just isn't going to be part of the deal, not in the sense that we view LOVE in the West. I'm sure there's successful long-term loving relationships out there...I simply haven't witnessed any to date.

I've never spent long enough in Thailand to conduct what I would call a proper long-term relationship. Sorry, but I don't think seeing the boyfriend for a few weeks a year and mailing him cheques the rest of the time counts. I have 'fallen' (appropriate word) for several Thais and those relationships have always ended up being far more painful than fulfilling. I plan to live full time in Thailand from early in the new year and the idea is to see a handful of young men I am fond of on a rota basis - a compromise, if you like, between being a butterfly and totally monogamous. I hope this will give me 'quality' time with them, while avoiding some of the complications of being too deeply involved. We'll see if it works out. A handsome young prince might turn up and upset the applecart by transforming me into a drooling old fool again.

Nelson · Author: **Nelson** » Tue 30 Nov, 2004 1:49 pm

I can relate to your touching account, zzz; in fact I envy the fact that you have found what you were looking for. Many of us haven't. 
I travel to Thailand four times a year for three weeks at a time and have met many guys on the scene, only one of whom did I find unlikeable. Never had I met one that I wanted to see again and again until a trip earlier this year when I offed someone who seems special. I shall be seeing him again soon- in 41 days to be precise. 
However, fond as I am of him and I think he of me, I do not want this relationship to be too intense for a number of reasons, only one of which is the struggle that we share in relating verbally. Not only do I not wish to commit myself (I remain a butterfly), I do not wish him to expect too much of me. This includes both financially and in terms of time. 
A few years ago, I was involved with an African guy in The Gambia, whom I would see two or three times a year and with whom I stayed in contact by phone and letter. However hard I tried (and his English was excellent) I could not persuade him that he and I could only be casual friends, separated as we were by distance and interests. The ending was painful for him because it involved the ending of his fanancial hopes and dreams. You must remember that Gambians are some of the poorest people in the world and prospects for young men very poor. 
This taught me an important lesson; I am not suited to the process of devoting myself to one guy for a long term relationship. I'm not proud of this- I see it as a failing- which is why I respect zzz's relationship. And so my new friend will be just be a special friend; I'll be kind, considerate and generous but I shall be careful not to encourage hopes that I shan't fulfil. If he were to find a generous sugar-daddy, I'd be genuinely pleased for him and a little sorry for myself but I know there'll be many more like him. That is why I love Thailand.

American Teacher · Author: **American Teacher** » Tue 30 Nov, 2004 10:17 pm

My Thai husband and I met 3 1/2 years ago. At the time, he was a bar back in a go-go bar, but had little "business" and didn't like the life. We hit it off immediately and continued to stay in touch. 
 
He began to work outside of the bars, and I began visiting more and more frequently. I would be lying if I said none of this was reliant on money -- I gave him a decent amount each time I came and even helped him through some school while I was back in the US. Each time I came (about 2-3 times per year), we became closer and closer. Sex was great, but the kinship and comfort we built with each other was far more rewarding. 
 
I fell in love with him as well as Thailand and decided that I needed to make a leap of faith both personally and professionally. Due to the fact that I was fairly young (32 years old) and a teacher in the states, the transition to taking a year leave-of-absence and getting a job in the LOS was fairly easy. I lived there for 1 ful year. 
 
Leaving family and friends was tough, but turned out to be well worth it. During my stay in Thailand, my boyfriend and I lived together and shared all the bills. I of course, was making more money so I was footing most of the bills. However, we were hardly living in "style" and some months we could barely even pay our bills. I will never forget the night I sat him down and told him life for the near future was going to be very rough and that we would not have a lot of money to spend having superfluous fun. He turned to me and said, "Tree-lak, I don't care about the money. If I did, I would have never stayed with you this long. I love you." 
 
So you see, he has taught me that Thais can break out of their expectations and that love can exist. As much as I have learned to accept his Thai ways, he also has learned the importance of expressing feelings and being honest (not just saving face) in western fashion. 
 
We both have grown so much. We were married in a Thai Lanna-style wedding on July 9, 2004 in front of 250 members of his family and friends in Prayo, Thailand. 
 
It can happen, but it isn't easy. Don't look for it, but never stop hoping that it can actually happen to you. 
 
-Chris<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/wink.gif ALT=";)">

Author: **pattayagay** » Tue 30 Nov, 2004 11:00 pm

You sound so sweet,do u ever stray frrom your "hubby"? 
I would love to have met you last week when i was in Thailand.I would have love to have shown you a good time. 
Your obvoiusly a bitch.A bitch that deserves a spanking. 
I like your love stories and how you and your husband met. 
I am jealous as me and my Ex ladyboy BF dont like romantic stuff. Maybe we could all meet when i come back in January.

Author: **Troy** » Wed 1 Dec, 2004 4:10 am

Thai boys don't have the same idea of privacy and private things as farang. They will look through everything in your room, even your wallet. They are nosy creatures. This is not a sign that they will steal. Some will steal in particular if using drugs but they are all nosy and this curiosity is not the same as dishonesty. Don't get upset if they look in a bag or a drawer. I had several boys search my stuff and come up with say hidden pic of old BF and say what is this. None of them stole anything. If you want privacy you better lock things down and hide the keys.

pete1969 · Author: **pete1969** » Wed 1 Dec, 2004 5:08 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>I feel that maintaining a relationship here requires a lot of turning the other cheek, going easy on one's wallet and not asking too many questions<hr></blockquote> 
 
I agree with this statement, mauRICE. However, I think this can be a good thing for many Westerners (myself included) who tend to over analyze their relationships and talk them to death. My last visit my bf told me "You sound like girl sometimes." Boy did that stop me cold in my tracks as I tell people I could never be straight because I could not deal with a woman's emotional needs and constant need for validation. 
 
The things you mention above, for me, are also the hardest part of maintaining my relationship with the bf. It is also very hard for him, and he tells me this all the time. We both chafe under trying to understand one another's culture, communication styles, emotions, and expectations. My bf is very good at trying to meet me halfway (for example he is very good at saying "thank you" because he knows it is part of my culture). So far, we both are willing to continue the effort, hard as it may be, but I wonder at times if we can both keep it up (and we both hope that as time goes by that it will become increasingly easier). And, as you stated, I also often wonder if the return is worth the investment. Again, now I say "hell yeah," but I am curious as to how long that might last. 
 
I do think your friends you mention might be getting a raw deal, but I also know that they are doing this to themselves. I think any relationship between Thai/farang needs very clear and firm ground rules, and the bf and I have a few deal breaker clauses in our relationship. I wonder if your friends got a bit of backbone and insisted on being treated fairly or else the bfs take a hike what might happen? Of course, the Thai men in those relationships might think they are treating the farang very well according to Thai standards, and the farang are just not communicating their needs and expectations very clearly. Hard to know. There is probably plenty of blame to go around. 
 
But I do honestly think you miss a bit of the bigger picture when you insist Thai people adhere to your definitions of respect, honesty, and love. Many Thai people lie because to them saving face is much more important than honesty (and of course they also lie for the same reasons that we do--I am not so naive as to think otherwise). Love is felt and expressed much differently. What they do to show you great respect, you might consider a great insult (such as not burdening you with their feelings). 
 
However, I do admire your knowledge that you are not at a place in your life where you are willing to sacrifice what you think is fair and right for you in order for you to wholesale adopt someone else's value system. At least you know this about yourself and you are being true to who you are (I think many Thai/farang relationships probably fail because the farang is often very good at paying lip service to their desire to change how they think, but in reality, they are not). Someone else said on this board once that you be who you are and let the Thai be who he is. Good advice, except that it is probably fruitless in establishing a long term relationship. Relationships take compromise and meeting one another half way. It is just that it is often hard to know where halfway might be. 
 
Pete

pete1969 · Author: **pete1969** » Wed 1 Dec, 2004 5:37 pm

Sorry to double post on the same thread. 
 
I read a comment once by gaybutton that if in a relationship with a Thai man remember the golden rule: "You have the gold, you make the rules." 
 
While this might be a bit simplistic, I wonder if at its heart it is a sure-fire recipe for a long-term relationship with a Thai. 
 
You make firm ground rules (together if possible), you maintain the bf with a healthy allowance and work with him to create a better financial future for himself, and stay consistent to this no matter what. 
 
Assuming you are a kind and thoughtful person, do you think most (95% or more)Thai men would ever leave a relationship where they are financially well taken care of by a person with a good heart? Most Thai men I have met who finish long term relationships have done so because the money stopped (and some of them stayed with their farang for several years past the point of a decent financial return on their time and emotional investment). 
 
In reality (and regardless of how you personally feel about it), is a steady supply of money/financial stability the best indicator for a long-term Thai/farang relationship (again taking into account you are not a total asshole to be around)? 
 
Pete 
 
PS-I am not sure I am advocating this position, but am leaning towards it. This is why I ask the "experts."

Author: **zzz** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 1:25 am

The 'you have the gold you make the rules' epithet is fine if you want someone to be your rent boy, slave, servant or lap-dog, but if you want a real relationship that is a recipe for failure. 
 
You have to make the rules together. Not sit down and write them out, but develop them according to changing circumstances. 
 
Sometimes a rule will come out of your background and culture, but sometimes, too, it will come from his. You can buy sex or companionship with gold, but you can't enforce a relationship or love with it. 
 
Of course your 'wealth' will be an issue in the relationship, but equally so is his youth and beauty. Try playing your gold card too much and he will start to play the cards he has.

pete1969 · Author: **pete1969** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 4:03 am

You know zzz, I am just not convinced. It certainly makes us all feel better to say that money cannot buy a real relationship in LOS. Yet of the many Thai men I have talked with, every single one of them identified a farang's ability and willingness to take care of them as the key factor they were looking for in their long term relationships. I know this does not apply to every Thai man, but IMHO, I think it applies to most of them. 
 
People the world over have a very strong attraction to mates who can provide them with security. In LOS, I think it is even more true. And, in the end, the gold card is really the only card that matters in MOST Thai/farang relationships. You take that card off the table and the game is over for everyone involved. 
 
Personally, I try very hard to understand my bf and his culture and to be a truly nice guy and good bf. He does the same for me. But as long as I act halfway decent, I think my bf's main concern is that I continue to provide him with financial security. To me, that is by far the biggest factor in the long term success of our relationship. 
 
So maybe, if one wants a long term relationship in LOS, one simply must be a nice guy and provide consistent financial support. As long as you do, then you will have the relationship. 
 
And maybe not. I don't have the experience yet to know for sure. 
 
Pete 
 
PS-I do think the "if you have the gold, then you make the rules" saying is a bit over the edge. However, I think too often farang bend too far the other way and allow themselves to be walked all over by men they are supporting! 
 
Also, I find it interesting when the words "real relationship" and "real bf" pop up in a thread. Who gets to define what is real? You? Me? George Bush?

Author: **wide traveller** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 6:24 am

This has been a fantastic topic for me as i have recently entered what is supposed to be a LTR with a Thai business guy who is about 35 and i am over 52. I had deliberately looked for and chosen a reasonably mature, intelligent guy with a good job. 
I simply have been drawn into the most emotionally draining experience of all time ...this guy at his best is very handsome to my eyes, great company and very affectionate. However I have never known such petulance and contrariness in my life which is normally cured by promises of trips or dinners etc. 
Like others have said it is as if it is planned. I am told that it must be a monogamous relationship yet i have the feeling that there are other farang guys whom he calls just friends that he may have some sex with.It is quite impossible for me to assess the relationship and it seems to me that the easiest way is out. 
This is a relationship that has been fostered initially by my friend but I have a feeling that he is wary when his petulance goes too far...all the time the feeling is there that the interest is only the money

American Teacher · Author: **American Teacher** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 7:15 am

"The Thai may respond initially but after the familiarity sets in, he takes advantage of the situation, knowing that the farang has become emotionally dependent on him. He wants more money, more this, more that, throws tantrums if he doesn't get what he wants and in some cases, physically abuses the farang." 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- 
 
This above quote is so far from the truth in my case. My bf (husband) has never shown any of these qualities. I wonder if this is a case of ageism a bit too. I met him when I was 29. Perhaps the closer in age, the more in common? Could it be that the younger/older scenario breeds this spitefulness discussed above? 
 
Thoughts? Ideas? 
 
-Chris

Author: **zzz** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 8:08 am

There is a lot of wisdom in what you say mauRICE. In the past I was 'bittem' - but it really isn't true in every case. 
 
Of course, I didn't meet my Teerak on the scene, and maybe ours is an exception that proves the rule. I don't lavish huge amounts of money on him, and, for example, everytime I take him out to dinner he will reciprocate. Of course my treat will cost more than his - but that's not the point. He has never asked me for money and has sometimes got angry at my extravagance, and he refuses to accept expensive gifts, telling me that I am 'stupid with money'. 
 
In some ways I recognise that I am as much the 'kindly uncle' as I am his lover and friend, but he has been extremely kind to me too. For example, I once, stupidly, mislaid my passport. He rushed to Bangkok, at his own expense, made phone calls, and generally held my sweaty hand, and said he would give me money if I needed any (thankfully ATMs don't ask for passports, so I didn't need to take him up on this!) 
 
I once asked him why he loved me - he replied 'because you are crazy Englishman man who needs someone to love you or you will be stupid fool, and I am crazy boy who needs to love you, and because you love me, and because you make me laugh and because ...'. OK, that's good enough reasons for me, and after five years it still works for both of us.

Author: **pattayagay** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 9:51 am

You hit the nail on the head Maurice,most of them i saw are lonely old guys with young BF.Thats why a lot of the time i have to put my ex BF into line ,sometimes its physical on both our parts including him last week smashing a whisky bottle.However i know a lot of barboys,99 percent have thai boyfriends,its a case of "pay for a BF". 
I found a guy last week who i met at karaoke who was ugly. 
He liked the way i dance to Enimem Hip Hop music and came and sat next to me.I was a little drunk and he starts asking questions about my ex BF etc. 
I told him thais cant be trusted how they break hearts etc,at the end he asked me to go back to his place and i asked him how much.I didnt want to as he was ugly Thai,so my plan was to say no when he told me.He said he wasnt a barboy but worked as an accountant.He was 37,3 years older than me and he told me he would like to know me better. 
I refused,if however he had been goodlooking i would have gone,but he had a good heart.When i left karaoke he beeped his horn from the late model mercedas he was driving,but i went on looks not heart.When i told this to my ex BF,he started to get pissed off,"Why man want you,you are ugly man,why he want elephant"? Then i showed him what a right hook was.

Author: **DELETED** » Thu 2 Dec, 2004 11:53 pm

DELETED

LTR...LTF...or, LTD

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